It's called 'Conversion' BitBop, Blockbuster, lets Golf, and other bloat ware

[RobB772]

THERE IS NO WAY TO REMOVE PRE-INSTALLED APPS (BLOATWARE) WITHOUT ROOTING PERIOD!

( HTC makes the Thunderbolt not Motorola )

Everyone who has removed these apps voided their warranty at that point in time. Sure you can say "it's reversible", but saying do it or stop complaining without putting YOUR cash on the line if something does go wrong puts none of your skin in the game. So unless you want to put money into a fund for unforeseen bricks ( and statistics say there will be some) I'd stop jumping down the throats of those who choose to not take that $$$ risk.  Remember...

Murphy's Law was not just a TV show, it is also an adage that "Anything that can go wrong will go wrong"

Even HTC in their new proposal to unlock bootloaders on some devices states doing so VOIDS YOUR WARRANTY (even though they are providing the "key" to accomplish this).

[NuDroidUsrr]

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SkyyDogg wrote:

Hey VZW:

Here is the deal.  I have been reading multiple posts about how to remove some of the pre-loaded applications.  BitBop, Blockbuster, Let's Golf, and other bloat ware.  Essentially you have committed the legal theory of 'Conversion' by not allowing a customer to remove these applications. 

You should get your silly act together or you will find your self in another class action law suit.  To force a person to keep these and other applications is equal to selling somebody a car and telling them if they change the car radio or even remove the car radio it voids the warranty.  

Since the car radio isn't essential to the safety and functioning of the car it's a non-essential piece of equipment.  Since I am reasonably certain 'Let's Golf' isn't required to make the phone function as a phone it falls into the same category.  

By not allowing the customer to remove non-essential applications you have "Converted" that functionality or ability to function.  It's further going to be a problem for you when you DO allow a customer to download and install new launchers.  Which are an essential piece of functionality for the phone.  

Kindly cease and desist from the practice of conversion and put out a new updated that will enable people to remove unwanted pre-installed applications.  

Don't reply back with "These are a legally binding agreement between Verizon and developers."  Because apparently there are quit a few people who have paid full price for their phones and still can't get rid of them, like me.  Please don't reply back with, "We at Verizon deem these as necessary to the functionality of the phone."  In what realm of reality can you tell me I need, "Let's Golf?"  Please don't reply back with,  "These only take up limited space."  It's clear by my review of these many and previous posts that the space utilized by your forced bloatware is significant and it's there that my assertion of "Conversion" exists.  You (Verizon) have converted the promised available space to your own advertising benefit at the cost of your customers. 

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  It is all up to the manufacturer of the handset when they negotiate the contract to sell the phones with Verizon. Did you notice that there are no bloatware added to the iPhone that Verizon sells? The contract between Apple and Verizon does not allow it. The others, Motorola, HTC, Samsung, LG, etc, allowed it in their contracts. Apple was big enough, and Verizon wanted to iPhone bad enough to forego the additional apps, but the others do not hold enough clout by themselves to do it.

  Verizon should allow the practice to remove them, they would be satisfying their customers, and would make them look better in the Customer Service area. God knows they really need it....

[AZSALUKI]

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RobB772 wrote:

If end users had not complained about Microsoft and PC makers loading up PC's with unwanted, uninstallable software "trials" and whatnot it might still be the norm there too. If they get enough guff for this practice Carriers and handset manufacturers will also give the option to uninstall these unnecessary, unwanted, resource using apps.

As for commercials, they don't reside on your TV and use resources you may want/need(?) to watch a program you want, they're transient. Also the US Congress passed the C.A.L.M. Act and the FCC will be cracklng down on those who make commercials perceived louder than the program. Even though they ( the commercial makers / advertisers) argued that they weren't actually any louder than the loudest point of the program, it was just all of the commercial was at that peak level. FCC has until  Dec 15th of this year to issue a Report and Order adopting the rules implementing the CALM act. I guess complaining does work!

Remember, if you sit back and accept the practice it will never change and most likely will get worse.

If ya always do what ya always did, ya always get what ya always got. (status quo)

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i'm not trying to be contrary here...and i understand the bloat frustration everyone has.....but this statement isn't true. i pay for cable and dvr service. i dvr nearly everything i care to watch and then watch at some time. my box holds X amount of hours and about 25% of that space is taken up by commercials. there's no way to set it to ONLY record the actual content of the program i want to watch. often i have to delete content that i haven't even had a chance to watch yet, in order to record something i really want to see. seriously.....about 25% of the service i pay for is absolutely useless.....and there's nothing i can do about it. if i am paying for a box with limited memory and the dvr service, then shouldn't i have the option of removing comercials to free up space?

[RobB772]

The only flaw in that analogy is that you are allowed to erase the dvr and the commercials get erased too. With the thunderbolt every time the update gets pushed it has been adding to the bloatware. That finite internal memory gets smaller each time. You'd be bitching more if you lost space everytime because old commercials , you have no intention of watching, never could be removed and new ones you're not gonna watch get added.

[RobB772]

Sorry forgot to add that erasing your dvr doesn't void the warranty.

[AZSALUKI]

true, but my point is that ads are forced on us everywhere....and they do utilize resources in other areas, besides smart phones. i can't get the cable content that i pay to dvr, without "downloading" the ads. and when i need to free up space, i can't JUST erase the ads. i have to erase the entire program...that i paid to dvr. so while erasing ads from a cable box may not void a warranty, at least i have the option of erasing bloat on my tbolt, without erasing critical files, even if it voids the warranty. i have no such options with my cable box. if i need space and want to erase, then i HAVE TO erase the program along with the ads. i'd say my cable box is more absurd than my tbolt......lol. 

[RobB772]

You're trying to compare apples and oranges. You are obviously dvring commercial tv because premium programs don't contain commercials. Your dvring would be including the same commercials had you been recording free ota signals. Time shifting of viewing time or recording programs not carried by your local area still get you the commercials carried by the free ota transmission. More to the point you are paying for a dvr to record the signals and that is what its doing. It's not adding commercials to the program you dvr, and they get erased when you do that function. If you record a premium program your dvr doesn't insert commercials, you get only the program you want. All this and never a warranty question. If you choose to erase a program it doesn't reinstall those unwanted commercials in addition to the new ones contained in your new recording.

[AZSALUKI]

90% of tv is commercial tv. i don't know what's considered "premium" (that you keep refering to). what i do know is that if i wnat more than abc, cbs, nbc, and fox, then i have to pay a cable company for the rest of my channels. i choose to use their box for dvr and hd capabilites. one of the things i pay for is the ability to record. the box i pay for has limited resources. they FORCE content onto my box by not allowing me to record w/o commercials. you can blame it on the networks if you'd like, but since the box can figure out when programs start and stop (and even figure out to continue recording when a program, like a football game, goes over), then it can figure out when ads are running. they don't however, allow me to domwload the shows without those ads. it's not that different. i know it's not exactly the same.....it's just an example of where i pay a company for a limited resource and they dictate what's on that resource. i get your point, but then shouldn't the cable company advertise "30 hours of recording (unless you're recording content that contains advertisements, in which case you can only really record approximately 24 hours)"?

you all can go and organize (i'd be happy to sign any complaint, petition, etc), alter your phones, or accept it for now. but starting the 10,000,000 thread on this matter does no good. 

[Wildman]

Lets express it correctly, no matter what is done there will always be complaints because a users thinks things should be different...  This world have got so many blind to the reality of the worlds, they think the world revolve on their views of things...   All companies are in business to make money and they either have to get it completly from customers pockets or work the extra funds with marketing and advertising..

Even nonprofit organization have to make money to servive and function..

[RobB772]

From some of the responses defending this practice I'll bet if we went back to pc's loaded to the gills with uninstallable software trials and other things Microsoft deemed you "wanted" and you were stuck with windows95 they'd still take the "oh well that's the way it is" stance. (I bet not :-P)